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I saw my T today and had a really good conversation with him. It's really cool to be able to go in and discuss stuff and NOT be in a crisis situation for a change!

I also have been feeling pretty good. I was in a really bad depression 2 weeks ago, but it lifted and I'm feeling decent. I hope it lasts.

Anyway, one thing he told me is that I am going to constantly having to be working on myself. Applying tools or skills or whatever. I will fall into depressions again, and climb out of them again. But instead of that making me feel bad, it made me feel more hopeful. I think because now I know the truth of how things are, and that even though I will fall into the pit again, I can work on getting out, and while I'm seeing him, he will help me get out too.

This thought occurred to me here while reading someone else's post. The thought is that maybe instead of thinking we have to GET BETTER FOREVER, we need to just learn enough skills and tools to get us through each setback. Recognize that there will be setbacks, and take each one as they come. I know for me, I was looking for THE CURE. But I see there is no big cure. What there is, though, is help for each setback, for each crisis. To get me through minutes, hours, days.

Maybe with each setback and each climbing out of the pit, I can get stronger and the setbacks might occur less and less. I don't know. But instead of being scared of each one, I can accept it and use the tools to get out of it. I know I have a team working to help me, and that makes me feel better too. I also know I have to enjoy these good moments while I have them, instead of being scared of "when" the bad times might come.

Now all I have to do is remember these words for the next time I'm depressed. So I can look back at them and see how strong I sound right now. And know I'm not as pathetic as I usually think I am when I'm depressed. Maybe this is something I can hang on to.

Does this make sense for anyone? Can anyone relate to this?

YES, BG ABSOLUTELY! Thank you for putting it into words - now we BOTH have a reference point to look back at when we feel hopeless!
You have hit the nail on the head... Progress, not perfection!

Can I relate?
You've just described the bulk of my recovery process!

That's an awful lot of recovery dots connected there. That really is how it works. This is progress, not perfection. You don't have to get it perfect because there is no perfect. There is "better", and we all keep striving for "better". That's all anyone can do!

You're right - it will come and go, up and down. All we can do is keep learning and growing and practicing. It DOES get easier with time and practice, and those setbacks become fewer and fewer. The more we work with the skills we have and learn the ones we don't, the less time we spend in crisis and the more balance we achieve.

Yes, I too think that is a great insight, BG! Your T is correct in that we will always be susceptible to setbacks, and have to keep working on ourselves. My T said the same thing. Here I am finishing therapy, with her blessings, and she has told me that I am a "work in progress." I will always have my same inclination to form an addictive attachment to someone, but I understand the warning signs and what to do about it now. I will always iwsh someone could "fix me" but now I know I have to fix myself. I have a tendency to be anxious and depressed, but I can accept it when I feel that way and know that those feelings won't last.

Yes, the bad times will come again, but you can deal with them. Like "riding the waves" and "going with the flow". :thumbsup

Recovery is like the poem "Life in 5 Short Chapters"

Life in Five Short Chapters

CHAPTER 1

I walk down the street.
There's a deep hole in the sidewalk.
And I fall in.
I am lost. I am helpless. It isn't my fault.
It takes forever to find a way out.

CHAPTER 2

I walk down the same street.
There is a deep hole in the sidewalk.
I pretend I don't see it. I fall in again.
I can't believe I am in the same place.
But it isn't my fault.
It takes a long time to get out.

CHAPTER 3

I walk down the same street and there is a deep hole in the sidewalk.
I see it there, and still I fall in.
It's a habit.
But my eyes are open and I know where I am.
It is my fault and I get out immediately.

CHAPTER 4

I walk down the same street.
There is a deep hole in the sidewalk.
I walk around it.

CHAPTER 5

I walk down a different street.

By Portia Nelson

In life, we can pretty much count on their being "holes" in the streets. My T told me to expect setbacks. It was how I got myself back up and moving forward when I had a setback that would make the difference. And sometimes now, I can see the hole before so I don't fall in in the first place.

Recovery, I believe, is something worth working on for the rest of my life. There is no destination called "recovered". But there is a fine journey of recovery.

I'm thinking this post (thread) should be calls "thought on life", not thoughts on BPD.

Because, BPD wasn't mentioned in the post, and there was no discussion of what is and isn't BPD. And that discussion isn't even relavant to what you posted.

We can't be cured of being human. We can't be cured of having feelings. (The later would be brain damage, not a cure!)

I think sometimes what some of us want to be "cured" from is just the stuff of being human. It's not a disorder at all.

Whether I can "get better forever" (or at least for life ) depends on what "get better" means. If it means I can have improvement that's true and lasting and permanent, yes, that's possible, and has happened for me. If it means getting rid of all the stuff I used to think was wrong with me, yeah, ain't gonna ever happen. (Though changing my viewpoint on what's wrong with me and what's okay has. ) If it means not having emotional up and downs, ain't gonna happen.

Ellen, great post! The fact that I'm human is something I need to remind myself of. All we can do is our best every day. And when we fall down, get back up. And the next time, hopefully, we won't stay down as long.

The story/anecdote/poem that GH quoted was recently posted The Couch here. I love that story/poem/thing. It reminds me of a saying I bring up at work at least once a week: "When you find yourself in a hole, the first thing you do is stop digging." Heh.


That's exactly what I just said to Amanda in our CC. That it's not a matter of how many times you fall on your ass. It's a matter how many times you get back up & dust yourself off.

Recovery from borderline isn't a linear process. There's no "first do A, then learn B, then move to C, then try D and then you're cured forever!" It's a matter of being able to hold onto the Genuine Self and take your foot off the gas when you find yourself hurtling toward a tree. It's a matter of becoming more self-reliant and self-aware.

BG, how will you add these insights / realizations to your Learning Library to help you remember them in the future? (I think Aqua said something about having a note pad by the computer when she's online. I used a business-card sized thing of notes I kept in my wallet. I think Marga offered a link to a wallet-size print-out of tools she keeps with her.)

I think the reason I wrote it as "thoughts on BPD" is because having this illness IS a big part of my life (unfortunately). It is a big part in how I live my life and how I react to things. I wasn't interested in writing WHAT I thought BPD is, I just wanted to write about how I think about it now and what "recovery" meant to me.

Ash, my T has told me often that I can't escape life events, no matter what they are. So it's really how I react to those life events that count. Whether I will take things as they come, or go off the deep end. Yes, this is something I will keep in my head and also can write down.

I am also learning that there is no straight line to recovery. I used to think there was. That if I took the right pill, or thought the right thought, that I'd be "cured." I see now that that's not possible. I can only deal with each moment as it comes. It was very difficult to learn that I will always have to cope with depression and depressive episodes. So I have to Radically Accept that this is the way I am and I will always have to struggle and work to keep stable. But maybe each time, it'll get easier. My T is more interested in HOW I deal with a setback rather than what caused it. So I have to keep moving forward and realizing that nothing is forever. Stuff I have to say over and over to myself.

Coming to BPDR helps me. It grounds me. It is hard to come on here and feel sorry for myself or have a pity party. Maybe I can do that for 5 minutes, but it won't last. I know I'll have to pick myself up and do the work here. That helps me. And knowing I can be honest here is another good reminder - I can outline my feelings and then begin to work on them.

I'm glad I'm here and that you-all are too. Thanks.

BG,

These are some of the best posts I have seen from you.... really made my night.

Life throws curveballs, and sometimes we don't know what they will be or when. We just get better at batting. We gain more skills. It won't always be a struggle. It will become less with more practice. Or that's what seems to be happening for me.



Whoever can't find the positive.... here it is, in this thread. It's nice to see people who have struggled make some good realizations.

Thanks Aqua. I really have been doing a lot of work in therapy and between therapy and BPDR, I have been having quite a few "aha" moments. I honestly hope they stick to my brain!

I consider myself recovered but I also believe it's a journey and not a destination. I do need to keep using the tools and taking care of myself - and will for the rest of my life. I perhaps need to focus on these things more than someone who hasn't been ill because I'm more vulnerable to depression - but I think in many ways those tools and focus have enriched my life.

I've been through a lot in the past few months (the loss of my cat, my family's reactions to my wedding, finding out some unpleasant news about people who turned out not to be such good friends as I thought they were) - and I am starting to feel quite low again - so I've made an appt with my GP and arranged to start seeing my T again. I have no qualms about doing that if it's what I need to do to keep moving forwards. If they rediagnose me with depression and decide I'm not "recovered" I can live with that. What's important is that I handle things as healthily as I can and get the help I need. I know that I am making progress, there are bumps in the road, but I'll never go back to rock bottom again.

I read a great book on BPD lately (called The Borderline Personality Survival Guide). The authors believe recovery from BPD is very much possible, but they also look at which symptoms are likely to change and which may always be there. They think people with BPD will probably always experience strong emotions and emotional sensitivity, but recovery is learning the coping skills to handle those emotions so that they don't impact on your life. They point out that some other people also have the same emotional makeup, but never developed BPD because they learned good coping skills in childhood.

Marga, that makes sense to me. That some people have strong emotions but have better coping skills. I never learned good coping skills. I'd either get very angry and lash out, or get really depressed about things. I was never in the middle, never emotionally stable. I guess by realizing that it's not an "all-or-nothing" situation that we can best learn how to take care of ourselves. My T wants me to continue taking my medication, going for therapy and working on skills. That way I can be more or less stablized. I need to work on balance in my life. And I can go from one extreme to the other in less than 5 minutes! So if I can look at my feelings and see where they're coming from and realize they won't kill me, that's a good step forward. I get so scared of my emotions! They overwhelm me. But my T is teaching me that they don't have to overwhelm me and that they won't kill me. I have to learn how to accept them. I have to learn that I won't "be this way forever" - that the feelings will pass. They always do. You'd think I'd know that by now. But I'm learning slowly. Making some progress. So that's good.

This thread is so encouraging and... well, all the comments are quite remarkable!

I don't remember a particular moment when I realized that This is The Way I Am - anxiety disorder, panic attacks, agoraphobia and all - but I get a weird sense of liberation thinking about it. Maybe liberation from tunnel-vision searching for some 'Holy Grail'?, but rather using what I'm learning to take each moment as it comes, trying to remember that there will be a good moment aFter each not-so-good moment, and do my best to enjoy the scenery.

It has somehow humbled me in a good way, a manageable way, a way that somehow reminds me, for instance, that there is probably at least one other person on a crowded subway that is experiencing an irrational 'fight or flight' sensation besides me, yet this notion also urges me to remember "It's my world, too!" (Does that make sense...?)

In the "Use the power of your words..." thread ibfuddled drew a connection between Love and Acceptance. The self-acceptance that is expressed here - by you, Bordergirl, and others - sounds so daggone healthy. It's truly awesome.


~ jr

Someone wrote a post a while ago asking why people come here to BPDR. Well, I come here because I know I'm not alone. I can express myself without fear of judgment and to also know that I'm not a "freak." I just get so emotional about things! Even in a good way. I should have been some kind of artist - a painter, actor, writer or musician. But I can't do any of those things. Those people can express themselves and if they suffer from depression or other mental illnesses, they have a wonderful outlet for it. I don't have that outlet. Writing or painting or acting is acceptable. So I have to find other ways to express myself. That's why I like therapy. I can talk and express myself and not be judged (of course I know that all artists are judged). And coming here I can express myself and not feel self-conscious about it.

I remember when I was little and I'd read a book or see a movie or hear a song. I'd get SO emotional about it. And my mother would have none of those reactions, that I could see. I thought that maybe there was something wrong with me because I felt things so deeply. Even now I'm that way. I can think of my trip to Ireland and get so overwhelmed that I want to cry. That's just the way I am. Gosh, I can get excited over a really good cup of cappuccino! I know that's not bad, but I used to think I was weird because of the intense reactions I would have to things. My H is not that way and I don't know if he understands how I feel the way I do. Maybe he's used to it by now, but he's just not like that. (Well, I should amend that - he does cry in the movies). Anyway, I appreciate being able to come here and express myself and let you all know how I feel about this whole recovery thing and therapy.

Hi BG! I think you had a very insightful session! Good for you! I also liked the poem that someone posted. I was thinking the same exact thing!

My T doesn't talk about 'set backs' for me but its very true. Continuously practicing our skills and tools will help us each time we do have a set back. Then maybe the set back won't be as bad. My T does say that I can never lose the ground I have covered and that's true too!

Roo

I like what Wondering's T said - that she's a "work in progress." That shows that she's always moving forward. And that even if she does have a setback, she can always move forward.

I've been real busy this weekend and have had no time to think about "myself". I'm out in the Real World and doing things and thinking about other people and issues. So "my stuff" is taking the back burner. But that's okay. I need a breather every now and then. It's not good for me to focus totally on myself 24 hours a day. I have to look forward and not worry about crashing or having a melt-down. Just be happy in the moment.

It's almost 7 a.m. and I went into the garage before. I heard birds singing outside. That really lifted my spirits! Gosh, I think Spring might actually be arriving! How cool is that!!!!

My former therapist told me that DID is a "severe form of BPD" so perhaps being diagnosed with BPD again would be an improvement for me, eh! My current therapist wants to talk to my former therapist so I called my former therapist on Thursday to schedule a phone conference with her for next month and while I had her on the phone I told her how much I appreciated her working with me on the DID in the context of a severe form of BPD so I am hoping she will talk to my current therapist about using the same model. I don't know why I find the BPD diagnosis more manageable for me when there are books that indicate that people with DID are often "misdiagnosed" as having BPD and that BPD has a worse stigma than DID. I just find there to be more "practical" solutions to working on symptoms of BPD while therapy for DID is not as well-defined nor does it allow me as much ability to use "self-help" tools for growth.

When I was diagnosed with BPD at the age of 18, I took the diagnostic criteria to mean I was a "bitch" and I was okay with that label because it seemed to have more to do with outward behavior than with internal malfunctioning of the brain or an overuse of defense mechanisms. It seemed like something I could work on to change as opposed to being so "messed up" that I would need long term psychotherapy. As I learned more about BPD and saw how it was often connected to PTSD, I was able to understand how my behavior was functional in some ways and dysfunctional in other ways. I am trying to see that with DID so I can better "accept" the diagnosis but the fact that the symptoms of DID are more "freakish" than those of BPD make it harder for me to accept the DID diagnosis. I still prefer to look at my coping skills in the context of BPD.

One of the interesting things I have read about BPD is that people tend to "outgrow" it, even in the absence of treatment. My foster mother is a psychiatric nurse, which has prevented her from being in therapy for BPD (there was only one psychiatrist in town and she worked with him at the hospital), but she manages her symptoms well enough on her own. She is 54 years old now and far less symptomatic than she was when she was younger. There were only a few times I ever saw her act in a Borderline way and it was never much of a problem for me, except the time she hung her son's pet wolf hybrid for killing poultry (she was trying to teach her not to kill, which is not realistic for a wolf hybrid, and she did not intend to kill her by hanging her - she got mad at me for cutting the rope so she used a chain so I could not cut her down and then she did not get her down in time so she died, even though we tried to bring her back). I know that my foster mother still feels depressed and suicidal quite a bit but she has learned to live with the feelings and she takes medication for the depression. At one time we had a suicidal pact to kill ourselves together but once I became pregnant and had my oldest daughter, I had to tell her that I would not die with her. There have been times I was afraid she would kill herself and I would have been sad if that had happened but I knew there was nothing I could do to keep her alive if she wanted to die badly enough. She has not talked to me about killing herself for a long time now so I think she has outgrown that means of coping with life stress. She seems to be able to handle her anger better, too.

All any of us can do is to live until we die. We do that the best we can but we are bound to mess up in a lot of ways over our lifetimes. I think that as long as our behavior is hurting ourselves and not hurting other people, our mental illness can be a private matter for us to work on without there being any harm to those around us. It is when our behavior has a negative effect on other people that we need to do whatever it takes to change those behaviors because it is unfair for other people, especially those closest to us, to have to live with our mental illness. It is never okay to use mental illness as justification for hurting others, though, and that can happen with BPD if people do not accept responsibility for their own behavior.

I like what you said Denim. Especially about not hurting other people because we have BPD and not use BPD as an excuse. I wasn't diagnosed with BPD until I was 54 years old. So I spent 40 years having rages and rants and carrying on and yelling and not knowing why. I always knew something was "wrong" with me but didn't know what. I was usually diagnosed with depression and anxiety. I had one or two doctors who told me I was neurotic. But how could I take responsibility for my actions when I didn't even know what was wrong and how I could deal with it? I'm so grateful I met my current T and he diagnosed me with BPD.

I can understand how confusing the various diagnoses can be for you Denim. It's like, which one is easier to swallow? Which one is "better"? I personally don't tell people I have BPD. I'm too embarrassed. I also never ever talked with people about my dissociative/depersonalization attacks. I was extemely embarrassed about them - I still am. I would do anything to keep people from knowing I had those symptoms. So I don't think it really matters about the diagnosis - it's just getting the help you need and learn how to deal with your symptoms, whatever they are. Maybe there's an overlap for you with the BPD and DID. I would think the main thing would be for you to get the best T you can to do whatever it takes to help you.

Unless you're a hermit, our mental health problems will affect someone in our lives. I try to keep my symptoms to myself. When I get depressed, I go "into" myself. I don't cry or anything like that. I just withdraw. I want to be left alone and not let people see how bad I feel. I have done a great job over the past 40 years of hiding my depression. But it finally reached the breaking point last year and I ended up having ECT. I couldn't take it anymore.

Yeah, we just have to take things minute-by-minute. I am just grateful for each minute that I feel good. I can't ask for much more.

That's interesting about your foster mother, Denim. I have the opposite experience. My aunt is almost 70 and is getting worse as she gets older. I think it's that she's being abandoned more and more by older family members passing away and younger family members going on with their lives without her. She doesn't have children and she saw her nieces and nephews as her kids. I think my sister and I are the only two out of dozens of us who still interact with her regularly.

Anyway, BG, I think it's great that you were diagnosed finally. I think for a lot of us it really does help having a direction in order to try and better ourselves.

I hope I am not repeating myself. I tried to reply and I got an error message so it appears my post was lost.



I wonder if your aunt is having issues with dementia as age related disorders can look like mental illness. She could be suffering from diminished capacity (if that is the correct term I am looking for).

You know, I never thought of that. She's always been off, but over the last couple of years, she's getting worse and worse. Oh God, I hope it's not that. I have to get her to the doctor. Sigh...